Thumper Club Forum
Technical => Project Progress => Topic started by: iansoady on March 29, 2024, 12:21:14 PM
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I'm not engaging in a full rebuild of this. However, as I think I've mentioned previously, there are a number of aspects that need sorting out before it hits the road. I am still waiting for the Yam 250 V twin to arrive as my transport bloke is very busy...
Anyway, immediate jobs are:
- Make & fit new control cables
- Make & fit replacement breather hoses as the present ones are dripping oil
- Think about whether I need an oil breather catch tank
- Tidy up the wiring
- Rewire handlebar switches - currently the left lower one is the starter, should be horn. The switches are early 1970s Lucas pattern as fitted to Nortons etc.
- Think about a better air filter arrangement - currently a bit heath robinson
- Modify the LH side cover as currently I have to remove the exhaust to get it off(!)
- Make & fit longer battery leads as the current ones are far too short.
For the present I'll keep the rather strange handlebar and footrest arrangement - I may even grow to like it!
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Look forward to seeing your progress Ian when time allows for some photos. Best of luck with it all 👍
Cheers, Michael
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.... you'd never started a job? The new toy has its starter button on the left (Lucas) switch assembly at the bottom where you'd usually find the horn. This, on the other hand, is operated by a corresponding button on the RHS. As my thumb is used to finding the horn on the left, I started what should have been a simple job to swap them over.....
Hours later, with truth tables, connection lists, continuity meters and oily cables all over the place, I'm struggling. The problem is of course where the Suzuki loom mates up (or doesn't) with the Lucas ignition and handlebar switches - which themselves have been modified at some time so the flying leads off them are differently coloured to what my workshop manuals say.
I think I've just about got it cracked but have realised I should have started by taking the switches apart so I could actually see what happens when various buttons are pressed. That'll teach me!
Note the profusion of red wires....
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Aye Ian,
OOOOOO! That looks like a good Fair Isle pattern! ;D
Is there a fuse in amongst it all and maybe a Zener Diode for good measure? 8)
I wish you all the best Ian.
Would you also let me know about the SVR250, I missed it! :( ;) It is a great shame that both the Honda VTR250 and the Yamaha SVR250 are such rare birds over here, as I think that they could be the answer to my wifes problems, with handling the all up weight of the Honda Bros400 (400lbs), these days.
Good health, Bill
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Hi Bill.
The little Yam is still wending its slow way to me. Hopefully it will arrive this week. My wife is having a hip replacement next weekend so I expect I will be fully occupied with nursing / catering activities for a little while!
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Aye Ian,
May I wish your wife well and a successful recovery? I am sure you'll be a good nurse.
Good health, Bill
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I think I'd be tempted to start from scratch with the wiring using Japanese switches. I'm sure you have it all in hand though Ian. Good luck and best wishes to your wife for a rapid recovery (only so you can get on with bike related issues 😉😱)
IanR
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Thanks for the well wishes.
I think I will do a full rewire but probably next winter as I'd like to get the bike on the road. But I like the Lucas handlebar switches and would like to continue using them. The Suzuki wiring is fairly minimal other than the connections to the CDI unit.
Oh, I'm told the Yam will be here on Thursday morning!
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The Yam arrived as promised and is actually a very cute little machine, looking muxh better in the metal than the videos I've seen. I've just done a couple of jobs on it - fitted indicators (out of the scrap box) on the front, adjusted & lubricated the clutch cable etc - and have just put a gallon of Texaco's finest in and it started up very readily.
I do however hate the vacuum controlled fuel system. There is no "off" position as such (well there is on another tap but you have to take the seat off to get at it). It only has On, Reserve and Prime on the main switch - the latter being a non-vacuum "on" independent of the vacuum. I may in due course ditch the vacuum unit and put a simple on/off tap in its place.
Hopefully I'll get it MoT'd next week.
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Oh no I won't. The vacuum arrangement is the work of the devil, with not only a vacuum operated device on the RHS of the bike but a vacuum controlled tap on the left. And a conventional on/off tap under the back of the tank where you can't get at it.
Oh well, turns out I was right to be suspicious of the vacuum arrangement. I put a gallon of fuel in yesterday, started the engine on Prime (started easily and sounds good) and left the tap on Main. When I went into the garage this morning, guess what? a pool of petrol underneath. Obviously the vacuum tap gadget is passing fuel when it shouldn't. Exactly what I feared. So I'll do my mod of replacing it with a simple on/off tap. When I lifted the air filter housing the front carb was full of petrol as well, so the needle valve in that one at least needs a good looking at. All thi because idle riders can't be bothered to turn the petrol off!
I've stripped both "taps" - see below - and will replace the one on the left of the pic with an ordinary on/off tap feeding the one on the right. I've replaced the vacuum arrangement in that with a simple gasket with a smear of wellseal.
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Aye Ian,
Have to say I am a wee bit green about the SRV, as I would like one.
The fuel taps sound the same as the SRX's and I have never had any problems with them.
However, if the float needle gets stuck and you come to a standstill at traffic lights, the fuel floods all over the hot engine and underslung exhaust pipe and the only way to stop the flow is to turn the engine "OFF" and hope that the whole lot doesn't ignite as it disappears in a cloud of vapourising fuel! :o
Fortunately, I was able to turn Sally "OFF" and the vacuum tap worked, as there is no way unless you remove the two bolts at the rear of the fuel tank that you can get to the "ON/OFF" tap in the centre of the underside of the tank to turn that "OFF".
I hope that you are able to get the taps sorted to your liking and can enjoy a canter on the wee beastie.
Good health, Bill
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Well nobody said it would be easy....
I guessed that the petrol would have got into the cylinders so turned the engine over with the plugs out (by turning the back wheel in gear - I'm not daft enough to use the starter) and was rewarded(?) by a spurt of petrol from each plug hole. But if it's got into the cylinders then it must have got into the oil as well? So dive underneath only to find the sump plug has been cruelly hacked about. I'm starting to realise why the PO wanted shot of it.
Of course said plug is lurking between frame tubes and convoluted exhaust pipes so is a bugger to get at - no chance of stillsons or mole grips. I've left it alone for the time being while I ponder.
Bill - you may not want one after all. There may be a red one at a knockdown price soon.......
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Giving up for the time being on the Yam. I thought if I could get the offside exhaust off I'd have more fiddle room but of course the allen screws holding it on are rusted solid and rounded off. I expect I'll have to drill them out. What other horrors await....
To partially restore my sanity and return this thread to its original topic I made a new clutch cable for the BSA. Very satisfying even though I'd ordered the wrong size inner and had to search my bag of spare cable bits to find the right one. At this rate it will be hitting the road before the Yam, which wasn't the plan.....
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Aye Ian,
Bill - you may not want one after all. There may be a red one at a knockdown price soon.......
:(
OH! Maybe I shoudn't lust after one, but I could be tempted as both Sally and the Monoshock were very disappointing after purchase.
Sally came home fine, with a ride up from Manchester to Perth and all was well with the world. That was until I went to start it the next morning and the rattle from the bore was like a flamenco dancer on speed, playing the castanets! :( So, engine strip, to find that the oil pick-up filter in the bottom of the sump and only accessible by splitting the crankcases, was half full of cotton fibres from using cotton waste to wipe up spills when changing the oil. Also, the oil pump seals (not a standard size and not available on their own! >:( ) were hardened, so machined the seal seats to take standard size seals available off the shelf. 54K miles later the old bird started heavy breathing, but with no rattles and a cloud behind like a Bantam on overun. :(
The Monoshock came home from Aviemore, without a problem, apart from only having 14psi in the front tyre, until rectified and a new MoT, less than a week old. Next day started it up and after warming through the rumble from the nearside main bearing up to 3,500rpm was loud! The PO was on chemo and not expected to see the end of the year and I'm too soft ...... :-[ A tide mark through the engine at main bearing level, from condensation and similar faults as those seen in Sally's pick-up and oil pump, resulted in a £1K engine rebuild that I did myself, plus paintwork. To add insult to injury, I find the handling a bit "lardy" when compared to Sally or the Duke, it's those wide profile tyres.
Here's hoping Bertie Bassett proves a better purchase and that you can sort the SRV, without too much ado.
Good health, Bill
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So I'll bite the bullet and drill out the cap head screws holding the exhaust on. Fortunately there is a short curved section which actually bolts on to the rear head so I won't be risking breaking / stripping anything that would need access to that head as it's a pig to get to. Enthusiasm waning slightly.....
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OOOOO, nasty! That sounds like a production engineers dream and a service manager's nightmare. The Boy Bros is like that in parts and only the reliability (fingers crossed ::) ) enable me to stay sane and for it to have passeed the 100K mile mark. Both SRX's required their exhaust studs renewing, as they snapped off in the head! :( Stainless replacements and bronze nuts and washers, with lashings of copper grease on renewal. So far, so good. ;)
I'll keep my fingers crossed for you.
Good health, Bill
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I don't know what on earth those allen screws holding the exhaust on are made of but it took me nearly an hour to drill the head off the upper one and make a start on the lower one. It's particularly awkward as they're quite low and need to be attacked from a crouching position. Oddly enough the bolt holding the silencer to the exhaust came undone with little effort. Remember the days when fasteners on Japanes bikes were as soft as butter?
I'm beginning to think the seller knew about these problems and passed them on to the first mug who came along. Although I did get it cheap (I thought....)
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What a carry-n! I eventually managed to drill the head off the upper Allen screw but the bottom one was as hard as the bobs of hell. Eventually I resorted to a thin cutting disc in the Dremel and managed to cut the head off and release the exhaust.
This is what remains: a moot point as to how to remove the remains of the screws but I'll leave that for another day.
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7687.jpg)
This is the offending sump plug from below:
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7685.jpg)
This tries to show the exhaust in the way:
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7684.jpg)
and this with the exhaust removed so I can get mole grips or if necessary a cold chisel onto it. Yes, I know.....
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7688.jpg)
All this hassle because of a daft vacuum tap arrangement - although of course I would have been cganging the oil anyway.
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Oh Ian! That looks a bl**dy awful (polite terminology) bit of "production engineering"! :(
My only suggestion would be new left-handed drills to remove the remains of the studs, after soaking them with Bulldog BDX, having given them a good heating with a MAPX torch.
As for the sump drain plug, a pox on Yamaha!
I have gone off the idea of a SRV.
Good health, Bill
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What a nightmare!
I can only admire your patience and perseverance Ian.
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Of course this was supposed to be my riding around bike while I fettled the BSA/Zuki. And I apologise as it's not even a thumper! Later today I'll attack (probably literally) the sump plug.
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Judicious use of a cold chisel to make a notch in the outer periphery, followed by a long punch has got the plug out at least. The "oil" that came out was about twice the normal capacity and stunk of petrol, as did the oil filter.
I'll let the cut-off screws rest in penetrating oil for the time being - no rush to sort them out. I've ordered the bits I need from CSM in the Netherlands who seem to have good stocks.
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It's taken all this time to get rid of those screws. Soaking in penetrating oil for a week made no impression. My HSS drill bits had little impact. So eventually I cut them off flush with the flange with the thin disc in the Dremel, carefully centre popped them and used recently purchased cobalt drill bits to drill out the remains. I didn't bother trying to save the threads as there's plenty of room behind for nuts so just drilled 6mm clearance holes. I must say the cobalt bits were a revelation - I normally just use HSS but also have some TIN-coated drills which have probably lost their coating by now. I could probably have drilled the heads off using the cobalt ones.
Still waiting for the bits I ordered from CMS in the Netherlands.........
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Ian, you have the patience of Job. As Bill said the fuel tap sounds a similar setup to the SRX. I found that if you replace all the seals then they do tend to be reliable. The seals for the SRX still readily available from Fowlers at time or writing or you could buy a complete (Chinese) fuel tap which I did for £24:10 (eBay) It's been reliable for 3 years
Seal repair kit available at £12:95 on eBay also. I should imagine Yamaha use the same seals on both machines.
Hope this helps in some small way
Ian R
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Ian, you have the patience of Job.
Ian R
Not what my wife says....
I think I'm now sorted as regards fuel taps, having effectively disconnected the main tap (On / Prime / Res) from the vacuum leaving it permanently active, and replaced the master vacuum tap with a cheap on/off version. So the plan is to leave the main tap in the On position and use the other one to switch off when leaving the bike. Also will allow me to switch to Reserve when out & about. I'll ignore the Prime position.
This is the main tap with vacuum blocked off:
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7692.jpg)
This is the simple on/off tap - note the blanked off vacuum lines to the inlet ports:
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7691.jpg)
And this the master tap under the back of the tank.
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/IMG_7693.jpg)
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Aye Ian,
Pleased to see progress. Appears to be exactly the same set up as an SRX, including the dodgy wire hose clips. I have replaced all my pipes with ethanol resistant hose and stainless steel fuel hose clamps. I had found the OEM hoses cracking/perishing and zinc plated wire clips rusting and having had the carb overflow, with a stuck float needle, I didn't want to repeat the experience from split pipes.
As for Job, I'll no go there, sometimes ....... !
Out on the Ducati for a canter today and the clutch cable popped. Dark mutterings, kept riding to see how far I could go using clutchless changes and with light traffic managed 26 miles afore turning "Off" the igntion, opening the valve lifter and gently braking to a halt. Trimmed the end of the cable, screw nipple threaded on and tightened, after which normal service was resumed for the 20 miles to home. Now to make up another cable.
Good health, Bill
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OK. Reattached the exhaust using nuts & bolts - a pig to get the nut on behind (see pic of top one) - I realised for the bottom one it was easier to put the bolt through from the back & put the nut on the front. Fortunately for once Suzuki provided broad enough flanges.
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/exhaust%20flange.jpg)
They weren't quite so helpful with the throttle stop screw. I hunted for this for ages before finally discovering it...
(https://www.iansoady.org.uk/SRV250/images/throttle%20stop.jpg)
CMSNL had the parts but were very slow - ordered on the 20th and not sent till the 26th, but did arrive on the 30th. Far from cheap as well.
Anyway, up and running now and sounds pretty good.
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Well I think finally I may have cracked it.
The CMS parts arrived eventaully so refilled with fresh oil, fitted the filter and completed the mod to the exhaust flange.
I put everything back together and put some petrol in the tank, opened the main tap and after half an hour had petrol dripping from the back of the main (left hand) tap. It was coming from the non-return valve mentioned by others here. So I stripped that out, cut a 1/4" Cycle thread in the exit stub, fitted a setscrew coated with welleal and filled the other side with JB weld. Left to cure overnight then reassembled and it looks petrol-tight, at least so far.
MoT booked for Thursday morning!
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Good progress Ian!
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Little Yam passed its MoT successfully this morning but the front carb is still weeping a bit of petrol so will have to come apart (again!) Quite a pleasant ride there & back - sounds nice, seems to handle well with a nice stable feel, takes off reasonably briskly. The front brake is a bit sudden so will have a look at the pads in there and also consider changing the master cylinder (14mm) for the 1/2" one I took off the 250RS a couple of years ago. Keep everything, it's sure to come in useful!
Then I can enjoy riding it and get to work on the BZuki.
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👍👍...good result Ian
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Hopefully it's now sorted out and I can get on with riding it and fettling the B-Zuki. Although I did note the (km) speedo wasn't working yesterday. The PO has kindly provided me with a mph version but getting at it looks like a bit of a hassle.
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Hopefully it's now sorted out and I can get on with riding it and fettling the B-Zuki. Although I did note the (km) speedo wasn't working yesterday. The PO has kindly provided me with a mph version but getting at it looks like a bit of a hassle.
But isn't that the point? We do tend to like a bit of a hassle, the mind games trying to work out a solution and then fettling in the garage to make that solution work. Otherwise we'd all be riding Hondas!
Ian
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Yes indeed. On another forum someone was extolling the virtues of PCP for new bikes. I did a quick check. Something like a RE Interceptor wanted about £1500 down payment, £90 or so a month for 3 years and then you either hand the bike back or pay another £4000+ to keep it. So that's costing near enough £5,000 just for having the thing!
Plus of course not having the delights(?) of tracking down these elusive faults and working out how to fix them. Sometimes preferable to riding......
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Yes indeed. On another forum someone was extolling the virtues of PCP for new bikes. I did a quick check. Something like a RE Interceptor wanted about £1500 down payment, £90 or so a month for 3 years and then you either hand the bike back or pay another £4000+ to keep it. So that's costing near enough £5,000 just for having the thing!
Plus of course not having the delights(?) of tracking down these elusive faults and working out how to fix them. Sometimes preferable to riding......
That's progress for you. In 1976 when I was 18 and still in the 6th Form I entered into a hire purchase agreement for my first "big bike" (a Kawasaki Z750 twin from Cradley Kawasaki) , knowing I would shortly be getting a job : 36 monthly instalments of £36 + my 1974 Suzuki GT250L as a deposit and at the end of the agreement the bike was mine. My mother had to be guarantor but I ended up being able to buy a new GS1000 on 1st August 1978 when I had a "proper" job , paid off the balance on the Z750 and took out a bank loan of £1200 from Barclays to buy the GS which IIRC cost £1800 or thereabouts.
By then I was able to run 2 bikes and was beginning to learn the art of fixing up old bikes. At the time of the Z750 I had a 1970 Honda SS125 and by the time of the GS a 1967 C15 as second bikes.
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Plus of course not having the delights(?) of tracking down these elusive faults and working out how to fix them. Sometimes preferable to riding......
By then I was able to run 2 bikes and was beginning to learn the art of fixing up old bikes. At the time of the Z750 I had a 1970 Honda SS125 and by the time of the GS a 1967 C15 as second bikes.
I passed my test on a Honda SS125, bought from Eddie Grimstead via Exchange and Mart in 1970 for £159/19/11d....wonderful memories of a fabulous little bike....thanks for reminding me ??
(Apologies to iansoady for ambushing his thread).
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I’m continuing the thread hijack (sorry). Just to add to the historical perspective, I passed my test in 1971 and my first bike was a Lambretta 150, bought as a frame with bits in boxes, for £2.
Sorry if this is a case of one downmanship!
It was a great little machine and never gave me any trouble whatsoever, despite my pathetic efforts to make it go faster.