1925 Sunbeam. Any tips?

[Itsme]

I love my older brother, but sometimes think we can't be genetically connected! He is 6 foot and built like a rake, I am 5 foot ten and built like a brick shithouse, he is also very clever so draw your own conclusions there. As well as this he is so mechanically inept it is painful, I once told him he had fitted the front tyre to his ancient bicycle backwards and he had no idea they could be directional.

However he has a friend of similar age to himself (70) who has acquired a 1925 Sunbeam 600 sidevalve single. The only downside being he finds he can't kick start the bike as his legs won't allow it. Mine are still (just about) ok for kicking a bike so I said I would love to go over and have a go at starting it so he can take it for a ride. I have ridden a couple of flat tankers before but someone else did all the fiddling with advance/retard etc to start the bikes. I know a little about retarding the advance, setting the air lever etc, but unless my brother's friend knows the rest I fear my limited knowledge may not be enough to breathe life into the bike.

Any tips gentlemen?

Ian

[themoudie]

Aye Ian Itsme,

   I am a bit stumped on this one, as there are so many practical variables to consider, without knowing how the bike is set-up.

If the magneto and  carburettor are OK, then I would pull the clutch in and turn the engine over on the kickstart. This should ensure that the clutch is freed off/no sticking clutch plates.

Not sure about this bit, but you need to make sure the carb has an adequate supply of fuel, so use the small "tickler" button above the float bowl, if it has one, to depress the float and float needle so as to fill the float chamber to overflowing.

Now set the ignition to "RETARD" and the air and fuel levers to just open, bring the piston slowly up to "Top Dead Centre" (TDC) using the kickstart, then ease it just past TDC. Release the kickstart back to the top of it's stroke. Now, with a swinging kick, kick downwards on the kickstart lever and you should at least get a splutter from the engine.

The ignition may need some advancing rather than being fully retarded and the air/fuel levers will need juggling to get a correct mixture to achieve smooth running and this is all before you engage gear, release the clutch and juggle all three levers so that the engine doesn't stall! 

If it were me, I would be finding a local member of the Sunbeam Owners Club or the VMCC, who knows what they are about with flat tankers and actually rides one on runs or more frequently, to give instruction.

SteveL may be able to enlighten us further, from his experiences as a young bor, with his Father's Sunbeam outfit? 

I hope that you are able to get a shot yourself and put a grin on your brothers face. There is "intelligence" and "practical nouse" and on this occasion "nouse" is required in abundance.

Good health, Bill

[iansoady]

Bill has pretty much covered it althoough I would try to start on about half retard rather than full as the spark gets weaker as it is retarded (a function of magnetos). It's probably a Sunbeam Lion as they were the most popular side valve 'beam. Some readers may remember the 1931 Sunbeam Model 10 I rebuilt a few years ago - very nicely made bike with a few quirks! Has the bike ever run to your / brother's knowledge? The club that deals with this era is the Marston Sunbeam Club: https://www.marston-sunbeam.org/ - lots of very knowledgeable and helpful people.

One further suggestion I would make would be turn the fuel off, open the air slide (tight wire - probably) and use a squirt of easystart (carb cleaner works as well) into the carb intake then try the method Bill describes. If the ignition sytem is OK this should at least get it to fire - if nothing after a few goes then there's no decent spark.

Bikes of this era are very simple and were designed to run for ever even when heavily worn.

[Itsme]

Thank you so much both for your extremely useful advice. I think the main thing I have gleaned is that when I pop over, rather than fiddle with a little knowledge (which as we all know is dangerous!) I will suggest contacting someone with real understanding and ability.

When thinking of all the steps involved in just getting started I am so grateful of the electric starters on my bikes.

I appreciate the help gents and will let you know what happens when I eventually get to see the Sunbeam.

Ian

[Steve Lake]

Hi Ian. this is a pic of our 'beam back in the day, a (500 oops 600) sidevalve, circa 1932/33 approx. many a happy (& cold/wet) time spent on the pillion, mother was in the 'chair' (better for keeping the wheel down during dads energetic left hand cornering :-) ), now, what i do remember of the starting ritual was ... pull the clutch in & turn the engine over a couple of times, clutch out, tickle the amal until a weep of fuel is seen around the tickle button, 1/2 to 3/4 retard ignition, air 1/4 open, turn the engine over until just past tdc let the kick start lever return fully then give it some welly , good luck ... i seem to remember the old girl would kick back with some venom at times and my mum would stay indoors until it fired up (to avoid hearing dads expletives ! )

[themoudie]

Aye Steve and the Ian's,

Now, how could ALF be construed as an "Old girl"?  OH! I forgot, Alfreda, after the late Viccies hasbeen. 

Hope that all goes well Itsme Ian. Grumph Ian's words of wisdom and SteveL's more detailed knowledge should stand you in good stead, especially if you find a local eggsquirt to assist in the basics.

Good health, Bill

[Steve Lake]

Yes Bill, ALF was a lovely bike, we did K's of miles on it, holidays all over the uk. but at least once a year we had to go to the lake district with friends with an aerial combo and just HAD to do the hardknott pass ... great days.
and ALF is still about, according to the dvla, last changed hands 20 years ago.

[Itsme]

Once again I am both grateful for and impressed by the knowledge and experience shown by members of Thumper Club. It must have been great growing up with the Sunbeam Steve, my own children still remember fondly being ferried round in my A10 outfit or my ancient, rear-engined Skoda, not to mention the Reliant Robin we had briefly.

Thanks chaps

Ian

[Steve Lake]

it was fun on the 'beam, but i must say when dad bought a sunbeam talbot journeys to cubria were a lot more fun and comfortable  ,

i too had a beeza outfit, a black gold flash and watsonian sports chair which i thrashed unmercifully .

my kids memories are of commuting from cornwall to norfolk in a 1275 cooper S + trailer before motorways in the southwest. anything from 9 to 13 hours ...

happy days